Three Kingdoms and Six Dynasties · Scholar

Wang Su 王肅

Attested AD 195 - AD 256

Passages: 4
Chapters: 3
Histories: 3

Overview

The translated histories identify Wang Su as a commentator and scholar. This record brings together 4 passages from 3 chapters across 3 histories, with names, dates, relationships, offices, and events preserved as source-backed claims.

Names

Type	English	Chinese	Pinyin
Personal	Wang Su	王肅	Wang Su
Given	Su	肅
Surname	Wang	王
Personal name	Wang Su	王肅	Wang Su
Personal name	Wang Su	王肅	Wáng Sù
Personal	Wang Su	王肅

Identity

Historicity: Historical
Identification: Named
Sex: Male

Sex: male
Explicit · jiutangshu:027:s0035, mingshi:058:s0231, songshu:055:s0041

Roles

Commentator
Scholar

Life and dates

Attested activity

Source Date: Text: Cao Wei · Western Interval: Start: AD 195 · End: AD 256
Explicit event contextual date · jiutangshu:027:s0035
Source Date: Text: 晉 · Western Interval: Start: AD 265 · End: AD 420
Explicit · mingshi:058:s0231
Source Date: Text: 王肅 · Western Interval: Start: AD 195 · End: AD 256
Explicit · songshu:055:s0041

Places and affiliations

Polity: Jin / 晉 · Relation: lived-under
Explicit · mingshi:058:s0231

Works and attributed material

Work: proposal on one hall with separate chambers / 同堂異室之制 · Relation: proposed
Explicit · mingshi:058:s0231

References in the histories

Open any source group to read the Chinese and English passage in context.

Old Book of Tang, Chapter 27Volume 23 Treatises 3: Rites 3 · 1 passage

刑部郎中田再思建議曰：干尊坤卑，天一地二，陰陽之位分矣，夫婦之道配焉。至若死喪之威，隆殺之等，禮經五服之制，齊斬有殊，考妣三年之喪，貴賤無隔，以報免懷之慈，以酬罔極之恩者也。稽之上古，喪期無數，暨乎中葉，方有歲年。《禮》云：「五帝殊時，不相沿樂；三王異代，不相襲禮。」《白虎通》云：「質文再變，正朔三而復。」自周公制禮之後，孔父刊經已來，爰殊厭降之儀，以標服紀之節。重輕從俗，斟酌隨時。故知禮不從天而降，不由地而出也，在人消息，為適時之中耳。春秋諸國，魯最知禮，以周公之後，孔子之邦也。晉韓起來聘，言「周禮盡在魯矣。」齊仲孫來盟，言「魯猶秉周禮。」尚有子張問高宗諒陰三年，子思不聽其子服出母，子游謂同母異父昆弟之服大功，子夏謂合從齊衰之制。此等並四科之數，十哲之人，高步孔門，親承聖訓，及遇喪事，猶此致疑，即明自古已來，升降不一者也。三年之制，說者紛然。鄭玄以為二十七月，王肅以為二十五月。又改葬之服，鄭云服緦三月，王云訖葬而除。又繼母出嫁，鄭云皆服，王云從於繼育，乃為之服。又無服之殤，鄭云子生一月，哭之一日；王云以哭之一日易服之月。鄭、王祖經宗傳，各有異同；荀摯采古求遺，互為損益。方知去聖漸遠，殘缺彌多。故曰會禮之家，名為聚訟，寧有定哉！而父在為母三年，行之已逾四紀，出自高宗大帝之代，不從則天皇后之朝。大帝御極之辰，中宮獻書之日，往時參議，將可施行，編之於格，服之已久。前王所是，疏而為律；後王所是，著而為令。何必乖先帝之旨，阻人子之情，虧純孝之心，背德義之本？有何妨於聖化，有何紊於彝倫，而欲服之週年，與伯叔母齊焉，與姑姊妹同焉？夫三年之喪，如白駒之過隙，君子喪親，有終身之憂，何況再周乎！夫禮者，體也，履也，示之以跡。孝者，畜也，養也，因之以心。小人不恥不仁，不畏不義。服之有制，使愚人企及；衣之以衰，使見之摧痛。以此防人，人猶有朝死而夕忘者；以此制人，人猶有釋服而從吉者。方今漸歸古樸，須敦孝義，抑賢引愚，理資寧戚，食稻衣錦，所不忍聞。若以庶事朝儀，一依周禮，則古之人臣見君也，公卿大夫贄羔雁、珪璧，今何故不依乎？周之用刑也，墨、劓、宮、刖，今何故不行乎？周則侯、甸、男、衛，朝聘有數，今何故不行乎？周則不五十不仕，七十不入朝，今何故不依乎？周則井、邑、丘、甸，以立徵稅，今何故不行乎？周則三老五等，父死子及，今何故不行乎？周則冠冕衣裘，乘車而戰，今何故不行乎？周則分土五更，膠序養老，今何故不行乎？諸如此例，不可勝述。何獨孝思之事，愛一年之服於其母乎？可為痛心，可為慟哭者！《詩》云：「哀哀父母，生我劬勞。」《禮》云：「父之親子也，親賢而下無能；母之親子也，賢則親之，無能則憐之。」阮嗣宗晉代之英才，方外之高士，以為母重於父。據齊斬升數，粗細已降，何忍服之節制，減至於周？豈後代之士，盡慚於古。循古未必是，依今未必非也。又同爨服緦，禮經明義。嫂叔遠別，同諸路人。引而進之，觸類而長。猶子咸衣苴枲，季父不服緦麻，推遠之情有餘，睦親之義未足。又母之昆弟，情切渭陽，翟酺訟舅之冤，甯氏宅甥之相，我之出也，義亦殷焉。不同從母之尊，遂降小功之服，依諸古禮，有爽俗情。今貶舅而宗姨，是陋今而榮古。此並太宗之制也，行之百年矣，輒為刊復，實用有疑。 Tian Zaisi, Bureau Director in the Ministry of Justice, made a proposal: Qian is honored and kun is lowly; Heaven is one and earth is two. The positions of yin and yang are divided, and the way of husband and wife is paired with them. As for the awe of death and mourning and the grades of fullness and reduction, the ritual classics have the system of the five mourning grades. Trimmed and unhemmed mourning differ, but the three-year mourning for father and mother has no barrier between noble and base, because it repays the kindness of bearing and cherishing and answers boundless grace. Examining high antiquity, mourning terms had no fixed number; by middle antiquity, only then were there years and months. The Ritual says: "The Five Emperors differed in time and did not follow one another in music; the Three Kings differed in age and did not inherit one another's rites." The Baihu Tong says: "Plainness and refinement change twice, and the first month changes through three and returns." Since the Duke of Zhou made ritual and since Confucius edited the classics, there have been different rules of suppression and reduction to mark the divisions of mourning regulations. Heavy and light follow custom; deliberation and adjustment follow the time. Thus we know ritual does not descend from Heaven or come out from earth; it lies in human increase and decrease, making what fits the time and the mean. Among the states of the Spring and Autumn, Lu best knew ritual, because it was the descendants of the Duke of Zhou and the state of Confucius. When Han Qi of Jin came on a visit, he said, "The rites of Zhou are all in Lu." When Zhongsun of Qi came to make a covenant, he said, "Lu still holds the rites of Zhou." Yet Zizhang asked about Gaozong's three years of silent mourning; Zisi did not allow his son to wear mourning for his divorced mother; Ziyou said that brothers with the same mother but different fathers should wear great-work mourning; Zixia said they should follow the trimmed-mourning rule. These were all among the numbered disciples of the four categories and the ten philosophers, men of high rank in Confucius's gate who personally received the sage teaching; yet when they encountered mourning matters, they still produced doubts like this. This makes clear that since antiquity increases and reductions have not been uniform. As for the three-year system, explanations are confused. Zheng Xuan considered it twenty-seven months; Wang Su considered it twenty-five months. Again for mourning after reburial, Zheng says one wears fine hemp for three months, while Wang says one removes it when burial is completed. Again for a stepmother who remarries, Zheng says all wear mourning, while Wang says that only if one followed and was raised by her does one wear mourning. Again for a child who died young and for whom there is no mourning, Zheng says that for a child born one month, one cries one day; Wang says one day of crying replaces one month of mourning. Zheng and Wang each take the classics as ancestor and the commentaries as lineage, and each has differences. Xun Zhi collected antiquity and sought what was left, alternately reducing and increasing. From this we know that as the sages recede farther away, gaps and losses become more numerous. Therefore it is said that houses that assemble ritual are called gathered lawsuits; how could there be a fixed answer? Yet the three-year mourning for a mother while the father is alive has been practiced for more than forty years. It came from the generation of Gaozong the Great Emperor, not from the court of Empress Zetian. When the Great Emperor ruled and the palace submitted the document, the former deliberations could be put into practice; it was compiled into the regulations, and the mourning has been worn for a long time. What a former king approved was set out as law; what a later king approved was written as ordinance. Why must we oppose the former emperor's intent, block the feeling of a person's son, diminish a pure filial heart, and turn against the root of virtue and obligation? What harm is there to sage transformation? What disorder is there to the constant human order, that one would make the mourning one year, equal to that for paternal uncles' wives, and the same as for paternal aunts and sisters? The three-year mourning passes like a white colt through a crack; a gentleman mourning his parent has lifelong grief, how much more for two full cycles! Ritual is embodiment, practice, showing it by traces. Filial piety is storing up, nourishing, following it by the heart. Petty people are not ashamed of inhumanity and do not fear unrighteousness. Mourning dress has regulations to make foolish people reach upward; they are clothed in mourning garments so that seeing them produces crushing pain. Using this to guard people, there are still those who forget by evening one who died in the morning. Using this to regulate people, there are still those who remove mourning and follow auspicious affairs. Now we are gradually returning to ancient simplicity and must deepen filial piety and obligation. Restraining the worthy and drawing in the foolish, in principle, depends on Ning Qi; eating rice and wearing brocade are things one cannot bear to hear. If ordinary affairs and court ceremony are all to follow the Zhou rites, then when ancient ministers saw the ruler, dukes, ministers, and great officers presented lambs, geese, jade tablets, and disks; why do we not follow this now? Zhou punishments used tattooing, nose-cutting, castration, and foot-cutting; why do we not carry them out now? Zhou had hou, dian, nan, and wei domains, and audiences and visits had fixed numbers; why do we not carry this out now? Zhou did not let one serve before fifty, and at seventy one did not enter court; why do we not follow this now? Zhou used jing, yi, qiu, and dian to establish taxation; why do we not carry this out now? Zhou had three elders and five grades, father dying and son succeeding; why do we not carry this out now? Zhou used caps, robes, fur garments, and chariots in battle; why do we not carry this out now? Zhou divided land and had five geng, and in village and school nourished the aged; why do we not carry this out now? Examples such as these cannot be fully stated. Why only in the matter of filial thought begrudge one year of mourning for one's mother? This can make the heart ache; this can make one wail. The Odes says: "Alas, alas, my father and mother, who bore me with toil." The Ritual says: "When a father loves his child, he loves the worthy and lowers the incapable; when a mother loves her child, if worthy she loves him, and if incapable she pities him." Ruan Sizong, an outstanding talent of Jin and lofty man beyond the world, considered the mother weightier than the father. Based on the thread counts of trimmed and unhemmed mourning, coarseness and fineness already descend. How can one bear for the term of mourning to be reduced to one year? Surely later men are not all ashamed before antiquity. Following antiquity is not necessarily right; following the present is not necessarily wrong. Again, those who share the cooking hearth wear fine hemp; this is a clear meaning of the ritual classics. Elder-brother's wife and younger-brother-in-law are kept distant and treated like people on the road. Drawing them in and advancing them extends by analogy. Nephews all wear hemp mourning, but a younger uncle does not wear fine hemp; the feeling of pushing away is more than enough, and the obligation of harmonizing kin is insufficient. Again the mother's brothers have feeling as close as Weiyang; Di Pu litigated his uncle's injustice, and the Ning family housed a nephew as minister. Since I come from them, obligation too is deep. Not sharing the honor of a mother's sister, they are thereby lowered to small-work mourning. According to the ancient rites, this conflicts with common feeling. Now lowering the maternal uncle while honoring the maternal aunt is to scorn the present and glorify antiquity. These are all Taizong's regulations and have been practiced for a hundred years; rashly cutting and restoring them truly creates doubt.

History of Ming, Chapter 58Volume 58 Treatises 34: Rites 12 · 1 passage

仿唐、宋同堂異室之制，前殿寢殿俱十五楹，東西旁各二，爲夾室，如晉王肅所議。 Following the Tang and Song system of one hall with separate chambers, the front hall and sleeping hall each had fifteen bays, with two side chambers on the east and west, as Wang Su of Jin had proposed.

Book of Song, Chapter 55Volume 55 Biographies 15: Zang Dao, Xu Guang, F Long · 2 passages

鄭玄以為祧者文王、武王之廟，王肅以為五世六世之祖。 Zheng Xuan held that the tiao were the temples of Kings Wen and Wu, whereas Wang Su held that they were ancestors of the fifth and sixth generations.

是以泰始建廟，從王氏議，以禮父為士，子為天子諸侯，祭以天子諸侯，其屍服以士服。 Therefore, when the Taishi temples were established, Wang's proposal was adopted: by ritual the father had been a common officer while the son became Son of Heaven or feudal lord; sacrifice was performed with royal rites, but the impersonator wore an officer's garment.